What class do you play and how does weaving skills feel?
Are there any classes you can’t comfortably play anymore, or still play but need to change your gameplay/rotation and opener?
I’m playing a relatively lax class (WHM - in terms of clipping and difficulty) and I’m branching out to other classes such as SCH and MNK. While playing them I feel like I have some weaving problems and wonder if anybody feels the same way, and if they have any tips or advice on personal experience with the ping, and if people try to follow popular openers, but need to modify it because of ping/clipping, what is it now and what’s changed?
I’m an NA player on EU. My ping is constantly 110-130. I’m completely capable of double weaving on my PLD and SMN without clipping. Occasionally I’ll get a lag spike that’ll freeze my game for a moment, but nothing super serious. But I will never hate anything more than trying to make Garuda use Contagion. Pet lag+connection lag is not fun
I play from Brazil, 240 ping without VPN, 160 with. Double weaving clips a bit (0.1 to 0.3 seconds according to logs) so it’s still worth in a lot of cases if it’s a huge dps gain like the SMN opener, I particularly avoid double weaving some skills like when playing BRD whose Bloodletter causes massive clipping because of the long animation lock. There are some other skills like this but it’s better if you test it yourself.
BLM and RDM are barely affected.
In my opinion MCH is unplayable at high level and frustrating even at a casual level. And I also accepted that when playing Ninja I will lose around 1 GCD per minute from Mudras, but it’s still playable and strong in my opinion.
It’s worth to mention that sometimes the connection feels smoother than usual and double weaving doesn’t clip at all, these are rare and pretty random, usually occurring when I play in the morning (my timezone is EST +1.)
not from EU but i regularly play with 250~300ms on NA as melee , most of the time it’s fine apart from mudra and sometimes tcj hiccup and that slight delay when popping potions. as monk i find it inconsistent to hit true strike under pb so i just delay an ogcd namely tfc later. haven’t played around with row tk much to comment on it.
generally perform around 95th-99th but i try not to have ping as a deterrent to performance or an excuse if i’m doing bad, you’ll be fine if you’re not aiming for top logs/sr.
Playing from South of France, before they move the datacenter to West Coast I had 110ms, since they move I have like you, 170ms…
I can’t double weave anymore, so I’m using Mudfish with their Fastconnect feature.
It doesn’t improve my ping at all, I have a good optical fiber ISP with good routing, so using the VPN is not improving my ping at all.
But, the Fastconnect feature allow me to double weave, in most cases.
I can’t explain exactly, technically, what it does, it’s somehow like a local proxy that doesn’t wait for some server packets acknowledgement before allowing you to do something next, and so suddenly, you can double weave again.
It’s not as advanced as the notorious local proxy mod of Tera that was solving all these kind of netcode issues with some really deep intervention in packets between server and client, but the behaviour for double weave look a bit the same.
I’m playing BRD, so, outside of the opener, I try to decrease the double weave as much as possible, some are possible with the Fastconnect, some are not.
170 ping player. Fumas clip so nin is out of the question. For DRG, tether is always a single weave and gk + nas is a sketchy weave. Mnk under RoF- Peak, HF, FC, Brotherhood are the only good double weave abilities but there almost always is some clipping.
I use Mudfish and it helps a little bit, ending up at around 180 ping.
I play Ninja in savage, some paladin for extreme primals and a lot of things for other content.
For Ninja it feels mostly completely fine and I don’t feel like my parses are hindered by my ping much, maybe like 5% since the level 70 skill feels a bit wonky sometimes or a ninjutsu lags here to there but from what I hear that happens to people with low ping as well.
Paladin also isn’t an issue at all.
The other classes are kind of a toss-up. Bard pretty much feels impossible to play at a high level because you have to double weave and react to procs on top of the ping so I’m pretty sure I drop a lot of damage.
Shield healers feel very iffy to me cause getting the shield off before the tankbuster / raid AoE if you’re not exactly sure when it’s coming is hard (at least for me).
Personally I feel like anything melee is completely fine, spellcasters are okay to play, healers is where it gets kinda difficult and ranged physical is just something I can’t do.
190 ping from western europe, potions clip like shit, double weaving clips very slightly, playing ninja is a chore. SOMETIMES, very rarely, weaving goes through perfectly.
Double weaving clips vary on how hard the animation locks me - Some skills consistently weave properly, and others force a moment of unresponsiveness. This can generally be mitigated by ordering double weaves so the easily-interruptable animation goes last.
MNK’s clipping can get pretty bad at times, but its not the kind of thing that’s going to slam my parses down into a grey percentile. Any pets become extra-braindead on high ping (thank god for sicfrit).
By FAR the worst interaction with high ping ingame is MCH’s flamethrower. Trying to get that to go off the way I want it to is like trying to teach an angry bear to make coffee.
The game is very forgiving up to 200 ping. After that, you start to get issues.
I played BLM on Behe from Ukraine from ARR launch till SB. Had 150-160 until they moved servers to Cali, then it went to 250-300.
What you can do about it? Move to EU data center. Trust me, you’ll never look back. Game is much more enjoyable when you don’t die from aoe you moved out from.
I’ve tried a number of VPN services, Mudfish is the cheapest and is often the most stable service but lacks readily accessible features to route around problematic nodes that some of the other services offer.
As for rotations like everyone else I would recommend against trying to double weave, the issue however can be alleviated somewhat by modifying the amount of skill/spell speed in your build, you will also have to test if certain breakpoints for SS are the actual breakpoints for yourself or if you need to invest in some more SS (usually not a whole lot more) or you can make minor delays before you use buffs so they don’t drop off before the last weapon skill (this is for melee mostly). Usually there are also modifications you can make to an opener that, while relatively minor dps losses, don’t require you to double weave and are generally less of a pain in the butt to do.
Also, because I don’t see anyone else mentioning it, take some time to learn what leeway you have on slide-casting with casting jobs. For the most part you can actually get away with moving just a touch earlier than you used to be able to but as a consequence you don’t have as much leeway when starting a cast or after being damaged if the damage would cancel a cast.
I play on a US server from Japan. Two jobs in particular I don’t even try to play anymore. Some of them I tweaked the openers a little bit to get around double-weaving as much as possible. Some jobs are basically completely unaffected, namely the healers, which is good for me. (Although SCH has a fair bit of double weave to it)
Some in-depth job guides will offer you higher-ping variations of their openers or rotations, but for the most part you can kinda common-sense a solution for yourself. As long as you steer clear of NIN and MCH (whose performance is butchered by high latency) you will be OK amigo.
I have given up being a decent Machinist. I simply cannot meet the demand for using Flamethrower because server ticks and fitting in the needed GCD and oGCD in Wildfire. And without those, I might as well be throwing rocks at the boss for all the damage I do…
Sometimes, my ping and latency also affects me as a Ninja. If I go into my mudra too quick, it sometimes skip one of my input and I end up doing something completely different. But otherwise, I still can do most things on a good day…
At least I have my tanks, their rotation isn’t as strict at least…
I play RDM with 215 ping (using Mudfish, 320+ without) from southern Brazil. Used to be 175 with no VPN before server move. Thanks Yoshi-P.
In my opener, I have to skip the displacement right before using Embolden, because the time it takes to jump back, attack and jump in again is way too long. Even with the skip, I’m still 3 or 4 seconds late to the wildfire. If I use the normal opener on Neo Exdeath, I can’t finish the melee combo before Blizzard.
Double weaving is a no-no, it clips the next GCD by a huge amount. The new quick animation on potions is a life-saver. Even if I have the same uptime, don’t miss any buttons and get procs on a dummy, my BLM dps is much higher than RDM, and my NIN dps is painfully low (which made me go back to RDM for Sigma).
tl;dr: I never double weave, plus I skip an oGCD or two in my opener.
Playing from France, no VPN (I think these are mostly placebo, honestly), 160ms average ping and no packet loss. I play SAM and it feels OK, though SAM doesn’t have that many double weaves to begin with. Single weaves you can do normally and I have no problems using the standard openers for the job.
The main thing that I had to adjust for was the added delay when dealing with AoEs, but now it’s all fine and dandy.
I’d never go back to Chaos/Cerberus. Mateus has been so comfy, I love it so much!
I use wtfast atm and it does help but my pink is still around the 100 ms. i tried playing bard but i clip it too much to play for savage lvl. atm i only play pld/whm/rdm. which dont have double weaves.
420ms without pingzapper, 200ms with. I play NIN, GCD clips a bit if i double weave too much. Apart from that, everything is fine. Still managed to get 85% on god, so ping isn’t that much of a hindrance.
i play MCH…using vpn i get 150ms now and without is over 300…(west coast is a crap location for a mmo)
To be fair is kind of a pain (but i like the class so…) and i need to be perfect to not miss the timing of my wildfire and always use 3ammo open.
RDM for me is fine
NIN is a problem and will make you mad as hell
Sch/Smn is a great problem…For me the timing to input commands to the pet is a REAL pain!
All the DPS except Machinist are fine on 200~ms ping, playing from EU to US.
I’m sure depending on what you consider acceptable, if MCH beats in your heart, then you could do it. But you are being hampered the most by far on MCH since you will lose GCD’s and oGCD’s inside of wildfire every time you wildfire. And you also can’t overcome that simply through skill or speed, as the game won’t let ya hit buttons fast enough.
For all other classes I find the ping mostly makes mistakes more punishing, and possibly shaves off a few percent of your dps because you have to space out some double-weaves into single weaves, which could mean you miss buff windows with a gcd.
tl;dr EU ping is not the reason you’re not 90th percentile. Unless you play MCH. MCH feels like hell.
You basically still have the good times when NA servers were on the “east coast” for us EU people.
100-120ms was actually almost perfectly playable for most classes, including double weaving, the added difference to the West Coast made a lot of the things worse for EU people sadly.